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Microsoft's decision to abandon its controversial online check-in and game ownership policies is "great news for gamers," specialist retailer GameStop has told MCV.

A statement from the retailer reads: "GameStop welcomes today's announcement from Microsoft about changes in functionality for its next-generation console, the Xbox One.

"This is great news for gamers and we applaud Microsoft for understanding consumers and the importance of the pre-owned market." Analysis

Microsoft's original focus on digital game sales would have been a major concern for retailers, who may have felt they were being edged out of the equation through aggressive DRM.

It remains to be seen if changes to the Xbox One will be more beneficial to the consumer or the retailers.

Source: MCV

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guyderman's Avatar

guyderman@ Karlius

And as I've said before where were MS to show us that we weren't going to be ripped off.
Posted 17:05 on 20 June 2013


Just going to mention this.
Firmly in the rumour camp, to be taken with some salt and we may never know for sure now, but word has come out from an MS employee that the reality of the family share system was actually a demo system.

In order words, when you added a game to your family share, while you could play it in full, if your friends or family accessed it, they were actually placed in a special demo mode with a time limit ranging from 15 to 60 minutes.
When the timer expired, you were prompted if you wanted to pay to unlock the full game.

As a principle, I have absolutely nothing against this idea.

However, this was not how I ever heard it presented by the public faces of the Xbox Team, which I think led us to believe that anyone could in our group of 10 could play the game to their hearts content, albeit a maximum of two at a time.

The motto around the offices for the family plan was “It’s the console gaming equivalent to spotify and pandora” it was a social network within itself! The difference between the family sharing and the typical store demo is that your progress is saved as if it was the full game, and the data that was installed for that shared game doesn’t need to be erased when they purchase the full game! It gave incentive to share your games among your peers, it gave games exposure, it allowed old games to still generate revenue for publishers. At the present time we’re no longer going forward with it, but it is not completely off the table. It is still possible to implement this with the digital downloaded versions of games, and in fact that’s the plan still as far as I’m aware.

The last point is important.
Remember that these features are being patched out.
There is absolutely nothing to stop them being gradually rolled out over time.
The Xbox One in 5 years time may be exactly what MS envisioned releasing in November.
Posted 16:59 on 20 June 2013
Karlius's Avatar

Karlius@ guyderman

Guy everything you are saying is of a preconceived notion and has no substance. There are no truths in the user being ripped off it's just the fear of DRM that you have that leads you to believe that is the case. My argument that the benefits were fantastic for me and my friends are in black and white you may not like them or feel that they are apparent to you but at least there is some substance there, where as all you can give me is a generic blurb about being ripped off with no basis fantastic.
Posted 16:45 on 20 June 2013
guyderman's Avatar

guyderman@ Karlius

Ok, lets say that I am a one dimensional gamer - the point is that MS's so called benefits excluded the likes of me - hell their PR guy pretty much said that people like me could F**k off and play on the 360 (a console that has been out dated for nearly three years now). Is this the attitude of a company that I want to spend my hard earned cash on - No, it isn't. Their benefits far out weighed anything that I felt as a benefit to me and I am well within my rights to say that the service that they offer is not for me - the same as you can sing and praise that the benefits are good for you. I am well within my rights to disagree with you the same as you excercise your rights to disagree with me. They did a piss poor job of expressing the benefits and if the benefits were truly that ground breaking, why not organise a press conference to explain and show everyone these ground breaking features - the fact that they disn't speaks volumes.

And again comparing the innovations made on mobile phones over the last few years to saying 'Xbox On' and sharing some games through cloud is a really poor comparison.
People have embraced technological change to no extent over the past few years so I'm not sure that saying everyone is afraid of change is correct - everyone, however is afraid of being ripped off and MS did nothing to convince people that this wasn't what was happening here.
Posted 16:37 on 20 June 2013
Karlius's Avatar

Karlius@ guyderman

I am angry about the back track seething in fact. Your words typify everything I have summed up about the cynical user with a voice who can't see the benefits that the service would bring fixating on the negative and not understanding the positive as ultimately you are focused on the now and how the change would impact on your ability to protect that bubble.

Everything you say just classifies you as a one dimensional gamer set in his own ways with no belief in innovation your fixation on MS is priceless and just quantifies to me how out of touch you truly are.

If anything this has reopened up the realms of the PS4 to me as there are no benefits to owning an XB1 any more over PS4. I will go along with my mates who were all signed up to XB1 but we'll see what happens.

Unlike MS I'm standing by the benefits of the DRM service and see it as a missed opportunity to innovate the market. The comments about you can share games already etc are extremely short sighted. You could make phone calls before the mobile phone so does that mean that mobiles were not an innovation?

Innovation :

1. something new or different introduced.
2. the act of innovating; introduction of new things or methods.
Posted 16:20 on 20 June 2013


The point is that we COULD still have all of the things you mentioned Karlius, without the disc DRM.

MS just need to keep disc and digital content seperate. There is no reason on earth that they can't continue their plans with digital content. It looks as though they already plan to have all physical games on their digital platform anyway, so customers would have a choice whether to use old fashioned physical media or digital content with all the benefits this would bring.

I'd welcome this approach as it was only the DRM and mandatory install (on a non removable 500GB HDD) that I didn't think was a good idea.
Posted 16:15 on 20 June 2013
dav2612's Avatar

dav2612@ Karlius

How much of that is actually innovation, really? Gaming without physical media isn't new. The concept of sharing isn't new. Sharing digitally is new for consoles but is that really the best of it? Losing that stagnates the next generation?

You can't blame the press, it was down to MS to sell this big change, show and explain the benefits and make people want it. You don't get a bigger stage than E3 to do that and they messed it up. Press releases after with extra snippets didn't help either. Whilst you use the phrase too generically towards people, you are right in that some people don't like change and MS have shown how NOT to handle that.
Posted 15:57 on 20 June 2013
guyderman's Avatar

guyderman@ Karlius

I guess they wanted to sell more that just the console you were gonna buy! Seriously Karl you are coming across like a total MS puppet - we can practically read the tears in your eyes! - It's really rather sad that you honestly buy into all their bullsh!t so fully!

I've already answered my feelings about the so called innovation on another thread so I don't want to repeat it again and bore everyone. (Thread below if anyone is interested although I can imagine most people are bored of this by now)
Posted 15:48 on 20 June 2013
Karlius's Avatar

Karlius@ dav2612

No discs. No Storage of disks, No Sound of the optical disc drive whirring, digital transfers, loaning games with out using discs, no scratched disks, being able to take my games anywhere without carrying physical media, a digital ownership trading place, gifting/selling games without having to pass on physical media, friends and family being able to access my library from anywhere. All innovations for consoles.

If I got all that from the xbox wired article that I posted a few weeks ago how come the press weren't able to outline this and put it into a clear picture. Because people fixated on the negative and ignored the positive. I said what excited me about it now look at where we are at.
Posted 15:45 on 20 June 2013
dav2612's Avatar

dav2612@ Karlius

What innovation did sharing games bring? I've been sharing games with my friends since the 1980s.

You should blame MS. This was a crucial part of Xbox One and they absolutely botched the message. People can only react on the information they get and MS did an appalling job of getting that information across.
Posted 15:29 on 20 June 2013
Karlius's Avatar

Karlius@ guyderman

Good use of the car analogy and very true.

What I will say is there were plans for a digital trading post as outlined in the original wired article. Disk based trade Ins were still allowed and I could sell or gift games to my friends. So communities such as this would thrive as we could of all decided to set each other up as friends and 30 days later set up our own digital trading post.

It has been the short sighted people who didn't see the potential of these methods and were far too keen to blankly look at what could be a restriction than the benefits that were on offer and now we are back in time with no innovation and no movement. FANTASTIC.

So I hope you all enjoy the stagnated PS4 which has nothing to offer but an uprated spec and a share button. Forgive me for wanting to embrace change and the benefits that would bring.

When I stated one dimensional I meant the views being given were one dimensional there were no real thoughts about possibilities and no desire to move on.

The more I think about it the angrier I become I don't blame MS as the pressure that was mounting by the vocal who were scared of change and progression and in the most ill-informed or acting on half truths ultimately forced their hand.

Welcome back to 2005!
Posted 15:20 on 20 June 2013


I've had some amazing deals from both second hand games and trading in.

I wouldn't have been able to afford my first 360 without trade in.
Posted 15:12 on 20 June 2013
guyderman's Avatar

guyderman@ Karlius

I've never been shafted by the likes of Gamestop simply because I don't use them to trade games in as you are right their prices are a rip off - if you are happy to sell them a game for £2 then so be it, but there are plenty of other means for selling and trading games - a choice that MS were trying to deny us.

This aplies to any market and I've seen the used car analogy used a lot, aswell as claims that they are not comparable. This is an instance where it is comparable as if you were to sell your car to a dealer you will get a lot less than selling your car privately - PX the same car and the value you are given is a bit better but probably still not as good as you will get selling it privately. The main reason a lot of people will use the trade and sell services offered by the likes of gamestop is convinience - a lot of people are lazy and impatient.
Posted 15:01 on 20 June 2013
dav2612's Avatar

dav2612@ Karlius

I don't consider the prices of digital games to be any less of a shafting.

Trade-in prices are no different to retail prices... you have to decide whether you are happy to accept trade-in/retail price and consider if you can do better elsewhere. Being shafted is optional.
Posted 14:17 on 20 June 2013
Karlius's Avatar

Karlius@ guyderman

I suggest we all buy a vat of industrial grade vaseline then cause that's going to ease the shafting. By the comments of the community they all use them and like it.
Posted 14:11 on 20 June 2013
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